Wednesday, November 14, 2007

A Call for Justice: A Letter to the MP

The people to contact are your MP, the minister for Transport Canada - Lawrence Cannon and the minister for Public Safety - Stockwell Day . Their addresses are as below.

The Honourable Lawrence Cannon
Minister of Transport, Infrastructure and Communities
Tower C - 330 Sparks St.
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
K1A 0N5
Phone: 613-991-0700
Fax: 613-995-0327
email: mintc@tc.gc.ca

The Honourable Stockwell Day
Minister of Public Safety
House of Commons
Ottawa, ON K1A 0A6
Phone: 613.995.1702
Fax: 613.995.1154
Email: day.s@parl.gc.ca

Please send an email to them today. Feel free to use the following email or adapt from it.

Dear Minister ____,
On October 14, Mr Robert Dziekanski, a first time visitor to Canada was killed at the airport. The cause of death is attributed to two taser shots fired at close proximity by RCMP officers present at the scene. From video footage of the event it is evident that Mr Dziekanski was no threat to either himself or to anyone else. On the other hand he seemed to be suffering a severe anxiety attack on account of his confinement at the airport for ten hours after passing through customs. In stead of offering medical attention or negotiating with Mr Dziekanski, the officers seemed to behave in a fashion that can only be called trigger-happy. Furthermore, these officers also attempted to cover up their incompetence by lying about the sequence of events leading up to Mr Dziekanski's death. The events have only been brought to light because of video footage of the event captured by a bystander.

I fear the incompetence of the RCMP officers stems from a systemic failure and request you to raise this matter in the parliament. Since this event also took place in an area secured by customs officers at a national airport I request an enquiry into the airport procedures in handling visitors to Canada.

The video footage of the event is publicly available. No conscientous Canadian can see that and not be appalled by the sequence of events. I trust you will share my concern and shame at having treated a fellow human in such a fashion. Canadians look to you to pursue this investigation to the fullest extent.

Yours very sincerely,

_________


In case you send in your mail to the MP's, please take a moment to register your vote in the sidebar. Let it not be said that Canadians condone this and do not speak as one on how they feel on this issue.

136 comments:

varun xm said...

I have sent my letter to Peggy Nash (MP Parkdale-High Park), Stockwell Day and Lawrence Cannon.
Thank you.

Brian Dell said...

Why don't you tell all the battered spouses out there that people who throw furniture are "no threat ... to anyone" while you are at it? After all, just because they are wielding everything they can get their hands on as a weapon, from tables to chairs to staplers, if they managed to find something potentially fatal like a gun OF COURSE they would not use it! This man was the very picture of Canadian reserve and rationality!

This man did not deserve to die and I should not be sarcastic given that but the fact remains that morality calls for judging people on their intentions and foreseeable consequences, not on what is difficult to foresee. It is dubious for an initiator of violence to say that how the scenario will ultimately end is entirely foreseeable and that the initiator accordingly shares no responsibility for an unjust outcome.

Dr.Dawg said...

Thank you for doing this. Well done!

As for Brian, he should review the video. By the time the cops were on the scene, his tantrum was over, he was docile, and appeared to be surrendering to the police (hands up).

Brian Dell said...

Emphasis on "appeared". What matters is all the facts, and that means reviewing more than just the video. The facts are that when confronted by police he promptly turned around and picked up the nearest weapon he could find, which was a stapler. What appears to you to be a "surrender" gesture, has been described by eyewitnesses as brandishing the stapler in a threatening manner. This is not to say that excessive force wasn't used but rather to say the video did not show everything clearly.

Anonymous said...

Interestingly Walter Kosteckyj , the lawyer representing Zofia Cisowski in Robert's death is ex-RCMP. There have to be cops out there who are outraged by the ineptitude of these goons at the airport.

Anonymous said...

Thanks for putting this together. I sent my emails out X 3.I guess we do have a few heroes left in Canada. Brian Dell the retard obviously has missed a few of the salient points: RCMP had already predetermined they were going to taser him with their "Can I taser him comment" before even coming face-to-face with him or assessing the situation; Were acting against protocol to use tasers only when suspect is combative, not merely noncompliant. He was neither; The guy had his hands up in surrender; the cops tasered him more than once, despite the first one being effective; made no alternate attempt to diffuse the situation; made no attempt to tackle him despite having overwhelming numerical superiority; failed to render first aid when he stopped breathing; aren't to act on what he could do in the future but whether he was a threat in the present sense, lest we all be targets because we could be violent threats in the future and of course, lastly but not least, lied about it all and tried to suppress (permanently confiscate) the video and cover it all up. Anymore comments Meathead ?

Anonymous said...

One must wander what has happened here.
Obviously he was not reported by the airliners crew as somebody dangerous.
So whatever derailed this man must have happened going through customs/immigration.
I am not surprised to see someone acting like this after 10 hours of waiting.
I have been close to losing control at that same airport after waiting 2.5hours to get through customs alone.
That place has tested my patience and I am sure I would have lost it before 5 hours be up.
Not only the RCMP needs to be investigated, but the Airport officials and Customs/Immigration as well.
People get treated like cattle at this Airport, now we bear the result.

dominic simon solntseff said...

Sent.

Brian Dell - you're an idiot.

D.

Lara LaBelle said...

Is this the democracy we choose to live in ? Governments should be scared of their people, not the other way around. Our government has Roberts blood all over their hands, this is the result of 911. Happy Steve? Canadians, let make a difference . This man did not die for nothing, unlike our boys in Afganistan, wake up Canada! I will not condone this mans' death, if you do not write a letter to your MP, our PM or Stockwell Day, your silence is a victory for the totalitarian society we are becoming.

Martin M. said...

A MSN Groups dedicated to Zofia & Robert.

http://groups.msn.com/FriendsofZofiaCisowskiRobertDziekanski

Anonymous said...

Thank you for this. Done.

dave said...

This is extremely disturbing, it is becoming apparent more frequently that cops lack basic common sense, and panic easily when dealing with the public.

Anonymous said...

SOURCE:
https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=35935973&postID=1631559453023924761

I read several of the comments and the article published here and I have one thing to say, "Damn all of you to Hell, for your ignorant babbling on issues that you yourself never have to deal with!" For any of you ignorant morons who talks about how horrible these Tasers are put yourself in an officers position. Have you EVER had to subdue a violent person, I work on a Fire Department, in EMS, on the ambulance, and Emergency Room, and I wish to God that I was aloud to carry one. People are absolutely NUTS! Ask yourself this, WHY WAS THIS MAN SO VIOLENT?!?! You don't know what was happening in that room, you see it in the video but you don't know what was said, all you see is the mans back! Why don't any of you stand in front of someone who is crazed and try to talk them down! Now I admit, that the fact that this man died is tragic, but you know what ... Shit happens! WHAT!!! and I know he supposedly wasn't but WHAT IF that man was a terrorist? Would you feel bad that he was stopped from blowing up your relatives on a plane or in the airport, or would you be glad that the terrorist was stopped before any real damage occurred!? Also ask yourself this, how many times have tasers' been used worldwide? Do you know, can you even fathom? So What's 20-30 or even 100 deaths in a 4 or 5 year period? Hell, smoking, drinking, fighting, guns, car accidents, FREAK ACCIDENTS! More people die having sex in that amount of time than being tasered!!!! Hell I don't want to waste my time researching it but I'd guess that more people are probably struck and killed by lighting in a year than killed by the use of a taser! And compare the odds! Don't EVER EVER EVER judge these police officers, until your in that situation.
One comment I read even asked what the alternative would have been? They said something to the effect of does that mean they would have used their guns?
Go ahead, ask yourself, what would the alternative be? 100 's or 1000's of people dead from a terrorist, police officers killed trying to protect your ungrateful ass, YOU killed cause you pissed some guy off! Some lunatic going to jail for life and your tax dollars wasted away on giving the crazies and criminals better lives than veterans from war. Yeah, lets lock em up and give them 3 meals a day, education, television, a roof over their heads, and pamper to them, while we let our war veterans and homeless live on the streets and die because they couldn't get help, because your money was spent on keeping the bastards that killed people or drove while they were drunk or raped or killed or ate your children or guardians or siblings, or sold drugs to your kid and knew it would kill them. Yeah, that sounds like a plan! Lets just do away with laws, and the law enforcement officials all together! Lets just let all those crazies and criminals run ramped. Who needs rules and laws. In case your actually thinking I'm serious about doing any of that, then please, do the world a favor, find the nearest cliff, bus, gun, car, train, or whatever you can, and jump off, stand in front of, pull the trigger, try to stop or whatever you need to do to just PLEASE KILL YOURSELF NOW!!!! Because you don't deserve the right to breath, breed, or live for that matter. You are a disgrace to mankind, and you would do the world a favor by never reproducing, you worthless sack of ****. For all of you who picked up on the sarcasm though!, think before you go running your mouth! Now, some of you uptight @$$holes are mumbling crap still, let me say this!, Are the police ever wrong? YES, Are You ever wrong, YES!, Do bad things happen to good people? Yes! Do good things happen to Bad people? Yes! I'm not saying that this man should have died, I'm not saying that ANY person deserves to die, I'm saying, sometimes, to get the job done, to do the right thing, to save lives, to help people, to protect yourself, to keep your neighbor or your friend or your family safe. SOMETIMES You have to make a choice; you have to do bad things; you choose; you regret; you wish you could change things or had more knowledge or wisdom. SOMETIMES!!!!!! ..................... Shit Happens.
So before you run your mouth and say all these bad things that you have no clue what your talking about, !!!!STOP!!!!!, because unless you can recreate that EXACT situation, and positively 1,000,000,000,000,000 times out of 1,000,000,000,000,000 you would have done something different at that situation, at that exact moment, than what that officers did, You don't have the right to voice your opinion on how horrible these officers are. Weigh the risk vs. the benefits.
Do you think that those officers are glad or happy that they killed this man? I'll tell you this, EVERY DAY!!! I LIVE , WITH QUESTIONS! THE WHAT IF'S!!! is what we call em, and you'll never forget, or get over them. WHAT IF, I had kept searching, would I have saved them, WHAT IF, I would have kept trying would I have brought them back, WHAT IF, someone else was working her, would she have lived? WHAT IF, I did the wrong thing. I can also tell you that there's a WHOLE LOT of good WHAT IF'S too; like, what if I hadn't been there, would someone else have found them in the fire? WHAT IF, someone else was trying to revive them, would they have been able to bring them back like I did? WHAT IF I had called in sick like I wanted to, would that man ever have seen his family again, because I was the one who rescued him? But here's the thing, You don't remember the "Good" WHAT IF'S in public service, you remember the bad ones. That's just about all you can ever think about. We in public service, see things, do, things, and deal with things, that normal people wouldn't be able to. So don't question every bad thing that happens. Sometimes, ... Shit Happens, and there's nothing you can do.

Anonymous said...

To “ Annonymous” above:
This is a sad contribution to the blog.
“WHAT IF” you had gone into this rant at Vancouver Airport?
Would you deserve to be tazered and ‘subdued’ like the unfortunate visitor Robert?
Everyone knows cops have hard jobs. Why was no one else around that could help him?

It was sad and disturbing to hear about this story, the video, and especially the apparent clash between what we were told ‘officialy’ and what our eyes show us.

Bring forth an INDEPENDENT inquiry – maybe we don’t know the whole story.

But if the 4 officers are found Guilty of some misconduct, or criminal action (e.g. manslaughter), well as ‘Anonymous’ said: “Shit happens” .
They will have to pay for their actions.

My heart goes out to his mother and family/friends. What a disturbing story.

Fortunately my experience travelling through Warsaw airport, last summer, not knowing a word of Polish, was not as tragic – even though I had become somewhat frustrated as well.
The people there, fortunately, were much more sympathetic and helpful.

Anonymous said...

After watching this movie you will always remember the death of the man under the proud sign:

‘AIRPORT GREETING CENTRE’

How many people and institutions failed to help HIM?

Where were you: immigration officers ,passenger paramedics, customer service
passenger security staff?


and where were we canadian citizens…
walking away …

Only the police (holding its "Royal" title) was at the scene
-well educated to kill but with no training to act like human beings.

SHAME canada

z szymborski
***

“Canada has much to offer to newcomers. It has a welcoming, inclusive culture, clean environment, natural beauty, and a prosperous economy”...
http://www.immigrationinfocanada.com/

Anonymous said...

Letter sent to John McCallum (Unionville-Markham).

Just to note, I've added a request to consider a moratorium on the use of tasers until the enquiry into this case comes to a conclusion.
Amnesty International has brought this moratorium up because of the inappropriate use of tasers well before considering lethal force, or for using it on already incarcerated individuals. It seems these individuals did not abide by standard operating procedures, I assume because of a lack of knowledge or accountability on the use of the tasers.

Please, for the love of all that is sane in the world, let's listen more to a non-profit like Amnesty International, over Taser International, the company trying to sell our law enforcement these products.

Anonymous said...

I feel sorry for the guy, but you dont screw around at an international airport... I dont understand how any civilized person could throw a tantrum like that and expect not to run into problems.. Absolutely RIP for Robert, but I dont think we should start lynching Canada's Finest so soon.. We've lost many RCMP's recently, we have a responsibility as Canadians to stand behind our own, while we lend our hands out to others.

I believe we should be helping the family of Robert, as well as sending a letter to Poland and at least apologize that this incident occured.

D.Dickin said...

While this is most definitely an unfortunate death, it seems that you have been quite misinformed and, quite frankly, are watching the video through rose-coloured glasses. Your one-sided generic letter will not petition either Mr. Day or an MP into action, especially when these actions were justified.

I've noted several inconsistencies in your letter:

- They do not yet know a cause of death. Therefore you cannot state it was due to the Tasering, as it could have also been due to a heart condition, anxiety, or any number of other pre-existing conditions.

- Not a threat to "himself or anyone else"? How about the chair he threw? How about the lack of communicating with police, or anyone else for that matter? What about the hostile behaviour towards others?

- He was not "confined" in the airport. You make it sound like he was locked in the airport, when in fact he was waiting for his mother to pick him up.

- How do you know he was "relieved" when law enforcement arrived? He simply became combative with them.

- The officers resorted to using the taser because they could not simply wrestle him to the ground. If they did, then you'd be on them about why they wrestled him to the ground. The taser was used to quickly and efficiently subdue this irrational man.

These officers are the best of the best - the RCMP. They patrol the country worldwide and represent a high standard of policing in all of Canada. All they did was their job. They prevented someone from potentially injuring other people, and you're trying to have the officers charged with manslaughter? It is people like you who make me sick to be Canadian, not the RCMP.

Lara LaBelle said...

D. Dickin

You sure live up to your name. The poor guy was not combative! After he was shocked the first time he was laying on the ground involuntarily spasming - my five year old could of taken him after that. You can hear a cop yelling ' 'Tase him again'. Mind blowing that someone like you and the CEO of the taser corp can say a taser wasn't the cause of his death. The taser corp even had the lack of grey cells to say that he was combative after the first tase and deserved the second. The guy was jerking like a fish out of water from his neurons going haywire!

- Have you gone to college Mr. D? All Canadians must be blind to accept the government spin we'll hear on this. You should be writing speeches for the excuses we'll have shoved down our throats over this from Ottawa. You and Brain Dell are conservatives for sure.

Anonymous said...

OK, RCMP were doing their job;
So next time, when somebody tries to screw you over (some office in town), you turn around too erratically (because you are pissed off) and accidentally you fall over a small Christmas tree on the counter, then things will go out of hand; like watching Seinfeld for example; So you pick up the three trying to put it back where it should be but instead (you are pissed off so your hands are a bit shaky) the tree falls on the ground; floor is wet because it’s raining outside, so, big flash and the power is out! They phone RCMP and three minutes later you are dead!
Because they thought that you were a terrorist!
If it can not happen to you it may happen to your teenager son or your grandson.
They taser him, so he falls on the ground paralyzed, than officers will sit on him pushing their knees against his neck, they will sit on his stomach so he won’t be able to breath, they will twist his legs and arms, he will be screaming, calling you to help him but you want be able to hear him. They will keep doing that until he stops moving. Then one of them will pock his head with a stick to see if he is dead.
Would you consider that really as high standard of policing?
They will kill your son, you will never find out who did that, and why. They will lie to you about the whole thing.
Think about it!
What do you say then? Shit happens?
We all have relatives, friends, we all get pissed off from time to time.
A little different scenario from the Vancouver airport one, but, hey, very much possible these days!
Good day.

Anonymous said...

I think gestapo can be proud as they found very good followers regarding very quick and effective and effortless killing method that the black "death commando" is using. I would like to see the faces of those four stinky cowards finding a Joy in harrassing and tourmenting most probably ill and teryfied man. Does they have a families? Maybe even keep some animals... I wish them see their own children being treated this way and dying within some minutes. Do You think they would then understand something? Do they became less animallistic then? Do they understand the meaning of being Human or it's doesn't matter for them as we have seen. What else Can You do to eleminate such a dangerous fools that kills people instead protect them. I hope they will be Judged accordingly to their ruthless murder act. I Expect to see them guilty and punished.

christal said...

after watching this video, I was horrified and disgusted at the way things were handled......my comment here is going to focus on the events leading up to the tasering.

-We do NOT know if any attempts were made to help robert with language barriers....I think A HUGE contribution to this tragedy was the lack of communication. WHERE THE HECK WERE THE TRANSLATORS?? I don't understand. It is hard enough to leave your home country and fly all the way to a place where you know NOTHING ABOUT. He prob felt scared, frustrated and anxious. Combine that with the lack of effort airport ppl made to help his mom find robert. Plus what happened from the pt he got off the plane to the 10 mins before he was tasered??? we have a fregan 10 hr gap to account for....come on ! Man I couldnt sleep all night thinking about this tragedy

D.Dickin said...

Quote: You sure live up to your name. The poor guy was not combative! After he was shocked the first time he was laying on the ground involuntarily spasming - my five year old could of taken him after that. You can hear a cop yelling ' 'Tase him again'. Mind blowing that someone like you and the CEO of the taser corp can say a taser wasn't the cause of his death. The taser corp even had the lack of grey cells to say that he was combative after the first tase and deserved the second. The guy was jerking like a fish out of water from his neurons going haywire!

Your five year old is as strong as four police officers? Wow! We gotta hire your kid! That'd save so much money!

They called to have the man tased again because he was still resisting. The man was not simply spasming, he was still attempting to resist, and that is why they had to tase him again.

- Have you gone to college Mr. D? All Canadians must be blind to accept the government spin we'll hear on this. You should be writing speeches for the excuses we'll have shoved down our throats over this from Ottawa. You and Brain Dell are conservatives for sure.

A Government political standpoint has nothing to do with this. If you'd gone to college, you'd know this.

We have hired these men to protect us, and that is what they did. There is nothing wrong with their conduct, but it is unfortunate that he died.

Anonymous said...

To the Anonymous author of:

"I read several of the comments and the article published here and I have one thing to say, "Damn all of you to Hell, for your ignorant babbling on issues that you yourself never have to deal with!" For any of you ignorant morons who talks about how horrible these Tasers are put yourself in an officers position-I work on a Fire Department, in EMS, on the ambulance, and Emergency Room, and I wish to God that I was aloud to carry one."

You Watched 4 of our Finest "THUGS" commit Murder, and you wish you could copy-cat?

OH CANADA: We are in a lot of trouble.

Lara LaBelle said...

D. Dickins

The man was convulsing, not struggling against his captors. Most of the world is agreeing with me. Try having to stay still when you're zapped by a taser - go ahead. Police use tasers because they can , and threaten with it instead of reason. I'm embarrassed to say I pay taxes to pay RCMP to murder innocent people.

Lara LaBelle said...

D Dickins

You said there is nothing wrong with their conduct?
Only the fact they went against every single guideline recommended by the B.C. Complaints Report Commissioner.
1) He wasn't actively posing a risk

( In fact he was walking away from the police in frustration)

2)Police aren't to shock a subject multiple times

(He was shocked twice in 30 seconds)

3)Following a taser shock, a subject should be restrained in a way that allows him/her to breathe

(Did you not see the cop sitting on his NECK - or was it the part where they stood around and watched when they are trained to do the ABC's (airway, breathing, compressions) when a victim loses consciensouness

BTW - yeah dude - I went and have a degree but I minored in Psch and there is no such term as 'Excitable Delirium' any neurological, psychological, or medical DOS dictionary of assessed medical conditions. Look it up. It's a fabricated word our feds allow the Taser company and hired police forensic pathologists to use.

Conservatives love guys like you. Back to ranks with you, go on....

D.Dickin said...

Quote: The man was convulsing, not struggling against his captors. Most of the world is agreeing with me. Try having to stay still when you're zapped by a taser - go ahead. Police use tasers because they can , and threaten with it instead of reason. I'm embarrassed to say I pay taxes to pay RCMP to murder innocent people.

First and foremost, please learn how to spell my name if you are going to continue to argue.

Second, if you watch the video you will see that he is pulling his arms away from the officers and continuously moving away from the officers. This would not be so if he was convlusing, which is simply shaking back and forth and becoming helpless.

Only the fact they went against every single guideline recommended by the B.C. Complaints Report Commissioner.

Can you reference this statistic?

1) He wasn't actively posing a risk

(In fact he was walking away from the police in frustration)


More like he grabbed a stapler, pointed it at the police in a threatening manner, then proceeded to run for the exit.

2)Police aren't to shock a subject multiple times

(He was shocked twice in 30 seconds)


Who says they can't be shocked more than once? Please reference this as well.

3)Following a taser shock, a subject should be restrained in a way that allows him/her to breathe

(Did you not see the cop sitting on his NECK - or was it the part where they stood around and watched when they are trained to do the ABC's (airway, breathing, compressions) when a victim loses consciensouness


There was no police officer sitting on his neck. And perhaps struggling with a resisting moron they needed a second to catch their breathe. Defending Canada can be difficult at times.

I guess you're not a first aid major either, because the ABC's of first aid are airway, breathing, and circulation, not compressions.

BTW - yeah dude - I went and have a degree but I minored in Psch and there is no such term as 'Excitable Delirium' any neurological, psychological, or medical DOS dictionary of assessed medical conditions. Look it up. It's a fabricated word our feds allow the Taser company and hired police forensic pathologists to use.

I didn't even bring this term up, but I might as well reply as you seem to be wrong about everything else.

Search for "Excitable Delirium" on Google and you get 99,000 hits. Perhaps you should look up the cases of Mr. Stevenson, Mr. Gill, or Charly Miller.

Conservatives love guys like you. Back to ranks with you, go on....

Lara LaBelle said...

d. dickin

No cop on his neck? Did you watch the video? Why do you think the public is so upset? What an ignorant comment about hard to breathe being cops, pity it wasn't your kid.

He's convulsing, not fighting

It is compression , you initiate CPR by doing chest compressions. Circulation, I can't believe you finished primary school. Circulate doesn't mean to start CPR, compression does, and you are wrong.

Happy to give you a reference.

2005 Report by the B.C. Police Complaints Commisioner.

Only a inept fight happy idiot and a coward would think turning away is 'posing a risk.'
You're to thick to figure out 'excitable delirum' is a non existant medical condition. You could have a million 'hits on google' on it, it doesn't legally exist in the DMS (the medical bible you illiterate dip)

D.Dickin said...

Quote: No cop on his neck? Did you watch the video?

I didn't say there was no cop on his neck. Read what I said again.

What an ignorant comment about hard to breathe being cops, pity it wasn't your kid.

My kid wouldn't go having a temper tantrum by throwing chairs around in an international airport ;)

It is compression , you initiate CPR by doing chest compressions. Circulation, I can't believe you finished primary school. Circulate doesn't mean to start CPR, compression does, and you are wrong.

They didn't do CPR. You're speaking of the ABC's of first aid, which are Airway, Breathing, and Circulation. Look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ABC_(medical), http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_aid, http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/emergencies_first_aid/116061. Where are you getting compression from?

2005 Report by the B.C. Police Complaints Commisioner.

Got it. I see nothing but a group of fine officers who upheld their duties extraordinarily well.

Only a inept fight happy idiot and a coward would think turning away is 'posing a risk.'

I'd be a "fight happy" too after being threatened with a stapler. And the man was running away, not turning away.

You're to thick to figure out 'excitable delirum' is a non existant medical condition. You could have a million 'hits on google' on it, it doesn't legally exist in the DMS (the medical bible you illiterate dip)

The DMS? What's that?

Lara LaBelle said...

A sampling of comments reacting to a video recording of Polish immigrant Robert Dziekanski's death Oct. 14 at Vancouver International Airport after he was shot by an RCMP officer wielding a Taser stun gun:

"Please keep these Tasers out of the hands of these bone-headed cops. As if using the Taser wasn't enough , one of those goons is since pressing his knee into the unfortunate man's neck. Enough is enough!" posted by Observerk on Yahoo Canada's news site.

Satisfied d. dickins?

Lara LaBelle said...

...not to mention the Polish Embassy wants these guys 'brought to justice'.

D.Dickin said...

Satisfied d. dickins?

No. What did you post to satisfy me?

...not to mention the Polish Embassy wants these guys 'brought to justice'.

That's nice. What the Polish embassy wants is not what we have to live by.

Lara LaBelle said...

d.dickins you wrote the below

"There was no police officer sitting on his neck. And perhaps struggling with a resisting moron they needed a second to catch their breathe. Defending Canada can be difficult at times."

Are you really as ignorant as your posts? Obviously Mr. I never said that.

You can play Hardy Boy detective tonite and find out what DMS stands for. There is nothing to discuss further with you as you believe the cops did a fine job. You should volunteer for Iraq, move to the States.

Anonymous said...

I am NeedleDodger and this is my opinion regarding the treatment Mr. Dziekanski received at the hands of 4 of my "employees".

That poor man could have been anyone but he is "her son". He was brutalized by those 4 RCMP and died due to their seriously flawed judgment. His Mother now will spend the rest of her life with a a broken heart because those 4 monsters didn't have even half a heart between them. These types of people are not even considered "potential employees" in my business.... so why am I paying their wages? Why are they lying to me? Why are they still being paid with my money for a job that they are incapable of performing? I believe that is called "false pretenses".

To "serve and protect". The video shows them protecting only themselves. And their lies serve themselves as well. It begs the question.. "why did they lie"? Is it because they knew full well they hadn't followed the accepted procedure for a case such as this? It makes one wonder what else they are capable of.

I have known Ian Bush since he was an infant so I do have a very good idea of what they are capable of and I shudder to think.

Yes, I sent a letter to all 3 "politicians" on the list. I am a bit short on faith in that respect. I regard the RCMP much like the Jews regarded the Gestapo a long time ago. I have done nothing wrong other than to voice my opinion but perhaps that is going too far in today's Canada? Is history going to repeat itself here in Canada? I certainly hope my children/grandchildren see how flawed this system is and make serious changes in the direction of true "justice". This kind of tragedy is NOT acceptable and those perpetrators of this crime must be punished to the full extent of the law.


My heart goes out to Robert's Mother in her time of grief.

Anonymous said...

To D. Dickin

From the author of:
SOURCE:
https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=35935973&postID=1631559453023924761

I read several of the comments and the article published here and I have one thing to say,

I can at least sleep in peace now, knowing that someone else who watched this video, has the balls to actually speak the truth and stand up for what is right! I believe that you and I are on the same page, and I completely agree with your views and opinions. And to second all of your sources that you have already listed, I am a Firefighter/Paramedic I work for a Fire Department, On an Ambulance, and in an Emergency Room at 2 different hospitals. And you are correct, ABC is Airway, Breathing, and Circulation.



For the ignorant author:
Lara LaBelle,
maybe you should pay attention to all things in life, before running your mouth on issues you have blatantly no freaking clue what your talking about, i.e. the Robert Dziekanski incident, or especially on a course of how to help save a life, hell, if you would have been there assisting the RCMP, you would be the dumbass on the news that we are all writing about, starting Compressions on a (at the time your referring to in the video) still alive, heart still beating man. I feel the need to educate you, if your feeble mind can grasp the concept. The ABC's are mostly used as an order of things to do when doing your physical exam of a patient. You make sure they have a patent airway, and do not move on to breathing, until the airway is secured, and after, you make sure the patient is breathing either on their own or you or someone else are for them, after establishing breathing, you then verify that they have good circulation, pulse, good color, and that the patient is not losing mass amounts of blood, anywhere that you can treat.

Anonymous said...

d.dickens
"These officers are the best of the best - the RCMP"

That's the whole point. Our finest are are capable of brainstorming beyond tazering to calm a non threatening situation.

You're an idiot

Anonymous said...

d.dickens
"These officers are the best of the best - the RCMP"

That's the whole point. Our finest are are not capable of brainstorming beyond tazering to calm a non threatening situation.

You're an idiot

D.Dickin said...

Quote: Are you really as ignorant as your posts? Obviously Mr. I never said that.

You again? Shouldn't you be in a first aid course to learn what the ABC's of first aid really are? ;)

Yes you did. You asked "Did you not see the cop sitting on his NECK" and I stated that they were not sitting on his neck. And you're trying to tell me you didn't say that?

You can play Hardy Boy detective tonite and find out what DMS stands for.

I thought you were referencing the DSM at first.

You should volunteer for Iraq, move to the States.

As a matter of fact, I serve our country in the military, and enjoy providing you with the right to free speech.

D.Dickin said...

Quote: I work for a Fire Department, On an Ambulance, and in an Emergency Room at 2 different hospitals. And you are correct, ABC is Airway, Breathing, and Circulation.

Thank you very much for your verification. Being standard first aid qualified myself, that acronym is something that was drilled into us right away.

D.Dickin said...

Quote: That's the whole point. Our finest are are capable of brainstorming beyond tazering to calm a non threatening situation.

This was a no-win situation. If the four police officers would have wrestled the man to the ground you'd be complaining the man was strong-armed by four police officers when he could have just been tased!

Anonymous said...

d.dickens
I have been humbled that you are in the military.
Please forgive me for calling you and "idiot" Poor approach and i am ambarrassed.

I do honor you for being a part of our country protection, however could u please try and understand that it is near impossible for me to comprehend that an interpreter could have diffused that tragedy?

The RCMP are not our finest..Yourself is part of our "Finest".

Be Safe!

Anonymous said...

When MAN tries to save the world - They send an army

When GOD saved the World - He sent a Baby

D.Dickin said...

Quote: When MAN tries to save the world - They send an army

When GOD saved the World - He sent a Baby


If the Bible is true, then God sent the baby, which was man, which created the armies and wars. So, didn't God create war?

Anonymous said...

d.dickin

I do believe you are bang on!

The bible is clear he did not come here to make peace.
We blew that privelege.
What we are dealing with is a dark world getting darker by the decade...
Legalized murder by our authorities is just a tip of the ice berg to come.
Our job is to stay in prayer and be strong in our faith.
That is the hugest war the bible warns us of.
It is a Spiritual War, and the dark side will have it's day for a time.

Anonymous said...

I am disgusted by the comments containing justifications for the murder we have all witnessed on YouTube. There are a few things I want to say to our so-called patriots defending our so-called protectors:
1. Learn the difference between convulsions and voluntary movements! Don't flaunt your ignorance.
2. Convulsing individuals have difficulty breathing to begin with. They gasp for air. For this reason people treated with electro-convulsive therapy for depression, are always given 100% oxygen during procedure.
3. Any attempts to restrain convulsing person would not be successful due to the muscular spasms. Any further attempt to top up the electric shock would make restraining nearly impossible without causing more damage to the person and further diminishing his respiratory abilities.
4. Convulsing person, who is being repeatedly shocked, stepped on (the neck), and hit on the head (the moment, which was conveniently omitted in TV version of the video, and which is clearly seen on YouTube) has slim chances to survive.
5. When Taser training is given, RCMPs are instructed to immediately sit the person up following the shock to assist respirations - not step on the person!!!
6. NO ONE HAS CANCELLED CPR!!!!

So, as much as our patriots here defend those who were chosen to protect us, they are missing the point. It WAS a murder. Murder for fun, for show. Of course, the guy had a weapon! A stapler! So, before he stapled them to death, they killed him.
Serving and protecting should be an honor. Doing honorable deed should involve using your brain and your tactics.
We are looking at lazy, cruel policing here, and I truly hope that this case will eventually be handled properly (although, I somehow doubt it...).
And why, may I ask, are there any objections for the interventions from Polish officials? Their citizen has been killed! Lets name things their real names! One has got to be blind to deny this after CAREFULLY watching YouTube video. So, why can the government not dictate their conditions? Even more than that - I think they should demand to conduct their own autopsy, or involve a third party for doing this.
I am ashamed of this incident. I am ashamed even more for reading justifications for this murder. One day it might be you or your child, or someone else you care about. Hope it never happens for you, so you'd never experience the pain and fear Robert and his mother had gone through.

Anonymous said...

TO THE AUTHOR ABOVE THAT WROTE:

"I am ashamed of this incident. I am ashamed even more for reading justifications for this murder. One day it might be you or your child, or someone else you care about. Hope it never happens for you, so you'd never experience the pain and fear Robert and his mother had gone through."

I absolutely agree with all that you have shared.

I haven't even recovered from the "Ian Bush" incident - Now This??

I have recently learned also our Finest "THUGS" have dragged a man out a drunk tank, took him to a back alley and left him there (drunk) to be found frozen to death.

There seriously needs to be an all out coast to coast Canadian out rage.

My God, We are paying for these murders, and not a damn thing we can do about it?

B.Wright said...

Breaking News CNN For D Dicken and Raving Anonymous.Nothing more cowardly than raving on behind the cloak of anonymity.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/11/18/taser.death/index.html

Unarmed young male twenty years old.collapsed and died.Just for raving anonymous I look forward to your appointment with Mr.taser.I bet you squeal like a little girl.

B Wright said...

Powered by



SAVE THIS | EMAIL THIS | Close





Man dies after police jolt him with stun gun
Story Highlights
Man dies after police use Taser device on him while breaking up fight in Maryland

Another man died in Canada last week after being shot with Taser gun

Amnesty International blames 150 deaths since 2001 on police stun guns

Taser International says many deaths involving stun guns have other causes

(CNN) -- A 20-year-old man died Sunday after being shot with a Taser device during a scuffle with a sheriff's deputy in Maryland, a spokeswoman for the Frederick County Sheriff's Office said.

Cpl. Jennifer Bailey said deputies responding to a report of a fight in progress arrived at the location in Frederick, Maryland, just before 5 a.m. ET and found four people fighting.

A deputy used a Taser device on one of the men, who fell unconscious, Bailey said.

The man was taken to Frederick Memorial Hospital, where he was pronounced dead. His identity was not immediately released, pending the notification of his family.

The deputy, who has not been identified publicly, has been placed on administrative leave with pay pending the completion of an investigation, Bailey said.

Amnesty International has reported that, since June 2001, more than 150 people have died in the United States after being subdued with a stun gun. The organization has called for police departments to suspend use of the devices pending study of their possible risks.

Few have done so, said Amnesty, which added that more than 7,000 of the nation's 18,000 law enforcement agencies use the devices.

Last week, an airport security officer in Vancouver International Airport in Canada used a Taser device on a distraught 40-year-old man on his first airplane trip outside Poland. He died.

In a statement released Friday, Taser International cited the Vancouver case and said it "appears to follow the pattern of many in-custody deaths or deaths following a confrontation with police. Historically, medical science and forensic analysis has shown that these deaths are attributable to other factors and not the low-energy electrical discharge of the Taser."

A bystander's video of the Vancouver incident that showed the victim continuing to struggle after being shot with the device "is proof that the Taser device was not the cause of his death," the company said on its Web site. Cardiac arrest caused by electrical current would have caused immediate death, it said.

In addition, "the video clearly shows symptoms of excited delirium, a potentially fatal condition marked by symptoms of exhaustion and mania such as heavy breathing, profuse sweating, confusion, disorientation and violence toward inanimate objects," the company said.

"We are taken aback by the number of media outlets that have irresponsibly published conclusive headlines blaming the Taser device and/or the law enforcement officers involved as the cause of death before completion of the investigation," said Tom Smith, the company's founder and chairman of the board.

But Amnesty International, noting that coroners have identified Tasers as a contributory factor in more than 30 deaths, said such a link cannot be ruled out.

The devices use compressed nitrogen to shoot two probes -- connected to the device by wire -- up to 35 feet away at speeds exceeding 100 mph.

An electrical signal transmitted through the wires contacts the body or clothing, "resulting in an immediate loss of the person's neuromuscular control and the ability to perform coordinated action for the duration of the impulse," according to the company.

andy Stout said...

ANOTHER LETTER TO SEND:

To: The Honourable Stockwell Day

Dear Minister Day,

Like thousands of fellow Canadian citizens, I am shocked by the sequence of events leading to Mr. Dziekanski's cowardly assault by RCMP officers at the Vancouver Airport and his subsequent death.

The video footage of this event is a disgrace to Canada's reputation as a just, compassionate, democratic country and it warrants nothing less than a public enquiry conducted outside the jurisdiction of the RCMP, who are the alleged perpetrators.

I trust that you share my concern and will pursue this investigation to the fullest extent.

Yours sincerely,

Andrew Stout

Anonymous said...

andy stout

Thankyou, very much I have sent your letter.

Just curious, what happens to our concerns by email, does Stockwell Day actually take heed?

andy Stout said...

Stockwell Day, like any politician, responds to public opinion the more plentiful it is, so let's all take a minute to send our emails, on the behalf of the late Mr. Dziekanski and his grieving mother.

D.Dickin said...

Quote: I am disgusted by the comments containing justifications for the murder we have all witnessed on YouTube.

Where is this "murder"? When did this take place?

and hit on the head (the moment, which was conveniently omitted in TV version of the video, and which is clearly seen on YouTube) has slim chances to survive.

Where was he hit on the head?

My God, We are paying for these murders, and not a damn thing we can do about it?

A murder? You must be in the wrong place, because we're not discussing a murder...

Anonymous said...

d.dickin

Quoted from MSNBC
"The investigation will include a probe by the Integrated Homicide Investigation Team in British Columbia, an independent investigation by the Commission for Public Complaints Against the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, an inquest by the B.C. Coroner's office and an internal examination of the RCMP's policies and procedures on Tasers, said Elliot."

Looks and sounds suspicous enough to me.

Anonymous said...

To author
B. Wright

From your so called "Raving Anonymous"

First off, I would like to congratulate you on your being the only person I've seen post here to use a line that I have not heard since grade school with your "I bet you squeal like a little girl."


WOW, I feel the urge to reply to that with a quip equal to that of your mentality and maturity level, however, I simply can't, your remarks have left me flabbergasted.

That's all I have to say to that comment, and on to the others that were left.

It would seem to me, that most of the writers in this blog would have preferred that Police Officers should not be aloud the use of tasers, for they are deadly and all Police Officers are in essence MURDERS!


While there are (with GREAT emphasis)VERY FEW, writers here like myself who feel that while Roberts death and all others who have died "Unjustly" are tragic, the simple concept of decommissioning tasers, for these deaths is simply preposterous.

Now, being of the latter, I would like to ask the first group some questions.

1. While the officers themselves are simply human, bound by the same laws of life that we are; I have read on one blog(can't remember if its this one) "if you don't accept risk and danger as part of the job, then don't be a cop."
Now seeing that this post seems to follow the ideation's of the first group. Let's entertain a thought.
Since people are dying from the use of tasers by police, we should ban them, following the same principal, since the use of firearms by police, can cause death we should also ban any and all firearms, and still, since nightstick(aka batons) have been linked to the death of "innocent people" we should ban these" Now, let's continue with this concept, now since inflicting pain CAN lead to death, we should also eliminate the use of peppering agents and any other type of "Weapon" the police have in the fight against crime.

So, now that we have left our Officers, with a badge, vest, and a uniform. Since they basically, (in summation of the initial quote)"Knew the job was dangerous when they took it, and knew what to expect" should go out performing their duties; "To Protect & Serve" totally defenseless, should try a different method. Maybe we are over-reacting with all these weapons; when was the last time an officer asked someone holding a gun at his face, to really think about what their doing, and consider putting the gun down and talking about the situation over a nice cup of coffee or tea, (or whatever the criminal[sorry] innocent person, prefers). I mean to say, why can't police officers be civil, and be calm in every situation that their lives are in danger. I mean after all; They knew the job was dangerous when they took it. Right?

So what is it that we are asking Police Officers to do? Are we asking them to Protect & Serve, to be the everyday protectors of our freedoms and rights? Or are we asking them to be sacrificial lambs, giving their lives in an attempt to be civil, to never resort to any situation with the use of deadly, or non-lethal force. Should they expect "innocent people" to follow the laws of the land.
I have to admit, that I am having a terrible time remembering the last time I was walking or driving around town watching police officers walk through town randomly using their taser/firearms/or any weapon at all, on any and everyone they please, like some barbarians looking for people to kill because they could.

And finally, I would like to be a little more clear on something that I stated in my first "RANT". I wrote in my first blog, "Don't EVER EVER EVER judge these police officers, until your in that situation.", I suppose that I need to clarify.
You see, I guess that I don't necessarily mean to say that so much as an order. However, I mean for that to be a challenge.

You see, I CHALLENGE! ANY!! of you, to LITERALLY!, put yourself in their sheos. To face what these officers face, and do things YOUR way, and see if you don't change your mind. I want you to put yourself in front of a man pointing a gun at your face, or a hostage, or even just in a violent situation, where they would use ANY of their weapons against crime, and do things your way. To be civil, and handle things more calmly. When your life flashes before your eyes and you realize that you can either
A: Do it your way, and handle EVERY situation calmly and collectively without the use of weapons of any type.
B: Do exatly what these officers do EVERYDAY!, and use the tools they have to get the job done. OR
C: Do nothing at all, and just stand their because you just realized that because you hesitated, while thinking about your first two choices, Your life flashes before your eyes as you realize that your never going to see your children, wife, family, friends, or loved ones again. Your wife is going to tell your children that you tried to do the right thing and be civil, but the other man didn't care, and while your casket is lowered into the ground to the heart wrenching sound of taps as it reverberates through the cemetery, the folded flag that once adorned your casket, is handed to your wife or your mother and the words (for me anyways)"On behalf of the President of the United States and the people of a grateful nation, may I present this flag as a token of appreciation for the honorable and faithful service your loved one rendered this nation." And the piercing sounds of your 21 gun salute send shrikes through your family and friends with tears flowing like rain across their quivering lips, while your fellow officers stand their saluting you.
And your children are scarred for they must live a life without a father, that didn't do what he had to, to stay safe and come home to them. it's now to late to decide because it has been decided for you, and all that you envisioned then comes true.

These officers have feelings, and families, and loved ones, and friends too. Like I said before, they don't enjoy taking a life. It's not like they kill and go about their day as if nothing happened. When an officers takes someones life, MOST! of the time they have to go through mandatory therapy and Post Traumatic Stress Debriefings, before they are aloud to go back in service.
These men and women, these OFFICERS, are not MURDERS! They are people. If you HONESTLY believe they enjoy killing or have no remorse even when 1000% justified, then their is no hope for you to ever grasp the truth and reality.

So again, I challenge you to practice what you preach, and do their jobs your way, and see how long before our flags are at half-mast because, your way doesn't work. Not to say that situations can't be resolved without incident, because most of them do resolve with simply talking, but when they need to, they do what they have to do to get the job done.

And one more quick thing. When you disgrace these officers like you have, you are dishonoring all of the officers that are serving now, that will serve, that have served, and that HAVE made that ultimate sacrifice. I honest to god, wish that when that happens to my family and they receive my flag, and are told that first part, "On behalf of the President of the United States AND the PEOPLE of a GRATEFUL NATION" ... ... *sigh* ... ... I can only wish that it were true. That I didn't have, the very people I spent my life, serving and trying to protect, disrespecting me, my service, and my sacrifices. These men and women take an oath, that puts your safety in front of theirs. They give and gave their lives serving and protecting you, for you to turn around and demoralize and degrade them, and call them murdering bastards. It's honestly sad, that this is how people are, completely or even partially ungrateful. It truly is.

And those men and women who don't end up making that ultimate sacrifice, who make it through alive. They are no less, hero's all the same as the ones who did make that sacrifice.

Thank you Men and Women of the Law Enforcement and all divisions of public service, and to all the branches of the military. I RESPECT YOUR SACRIFICES, and I will continue making those sacrifices myself along with you, for I am one of you...
I am a Firefighter/Paramedic and former soldier of the United States Army. God Bless all of you.

Anonymous said...

To Anonymous above supporting murder by the hands of our authorities.

You are retarded

andy Stout said...

Well, on the CBC news tonight the Prime Minister announced that Canada will conduct a full public enquiry regarding the taser incident at the Vancouver airport.
Let's hope it condemns both the cowardly assault of the RCMP officers, and the negligent staff at the airport, whose combined incompetence conspired to snuff out the life of this unfortunate man. Anything less than disciplinary action being imposed on the guilty parties will ensure an indelible stain of shame on Canada's well-earned reputation as a just and compassionate country.

Diane said...

andy stout

I felt a small sense of victory with that same news.

Congrats to You, Me, and every other Canadian in agreement

Anonymous said...

VANCOUVER/CKNW(AM980) - A Polish-speaking man who was recently fired from his job at Vancouver International Airport says he was working the night Robert Dziekanski died and wonders why he wasn't asked to help.
Karol Vrba told the National Post he speaks both Polish and Russian and says he had stepped into the airport operations centre to pick up some papers he needed for his work.

He says calls about a disturbance came in as he was going out the door and only found out about what happened when he came back.

Vrba says he asked why he wasn't called to see if he could help.

He says he was fired almost a month to the day after the incident and believes it was because he complained he could have helped.

Vrba says he was told he was let go because he was unsuitable for the job.

An airport official wouldn't comment, citing privacy laws.

Anonymous said...

Airport officials appear to be wiping people under the carpet to protect their ass?

B wright said...

To Raving anonymous

I knew you'd reply,I was counting on it, that's why I pushed your button. That's what a fireman with BIG BALLS does right.Something for you to think about.Your need for soooooo much explanation denotes a profound weakness in the text.You see this isn't about YOU.Consider your buttons pushed.I await your reply

Anonymous said...

Anonymous Ranter

You're retarded!

D.Dickin said...

Quote: Quoted from MSNBC
"The investigation will include a probe by the Integrated Homicide Investigation Team in British Columbia, an independent investigation by the Commission for Public Complaints Against the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, an inquest by the B.C. Coroner's office and an internal examination of the RCMP's policies and procedures on Tasers, said Elliot."

Looks and sounds suspicous enough to me.


That is entire point of the independent group who investigates the RCMP complaints. That is their job. What's so suspicious about that?

D.Dickin said...

Quote: To Anonymous above supporting murder by the hands of our authorities.

You are retarded


He's not supporting murder, he's supporting the reasonable actions the police took to protect us ;)

And you seem to be quite the mature person by calling him retarded. That's very intellectual of you...

Anonymous said...

B. Wright

You have to be the most dense blogger, that posts to this site.

Your "anonymous ranter" as you like to call him/her makes their opinions clear with explanation. And the only thing you post back is that you were trying to bother him or her, get a life.

I guess your just mad, cause maybe their points make sense to you and now your ego is hurt.

Anonymous said...

d.dicken;
"That is entire point of the independent group who investigates the RCMP complaints. That is their job. What's so suspicious about that?"

What is the point in spending all those tax dollars into all those investigations if all is "reasonable actions the police took to protect us?"

Unless, of course, you're not from Canada, and who gives a shit what you think, because most of like to believe we do have a high standard of moral law that allows us not to tolerate such actions as the "Robert Dziekanski" murder

Anonymous said...

It was reported that 5 percent of all "Canadians" agree with our blogging murder supporters!

Hmmm...5 percents suggests they could be related to, an acquaintece/friend of, or are Police.

Anonymous said...

From the "Anonymous Ranter"

You know what, the majority of you are right.
ALL LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIALS ARE MURDERING BASTARDS.
They can never do anything right, all they do is kill innocent civilians unjustly. The same should be said for all of those MURDERING BASTARDS in our Armed Services, they are no different! They all stand for the same concept. We should completely decommission them. Abolish all law enforcement. We would be much better without them. Do away with the military too, they only kill people too. Their all MURDERS!

Let's disband democracy and Laws, and the military all together.

LOL, And I'm the retarded one! LMAO

You know I think that the other anonymous writer above makes a very rational point!
Maybe I have hurt all of your ego's, and that is why I am retarded, if you would like you dignity and respect back, I can give it back to you. Only under one condition though. You can have it back when you earn it back. Most of you writers are so close-minded, immature, and irrational, that you can't see past what YOU! think is right or wrong. Well the world doesn't revolve around you and it's not going to stop people from dying when we imprison these officers and strip them of their weapons.
I would bet money that your mostly all hypocrites to.

To the anonymous supporter and D. Dickin. Thank you for supporting what is right.omlrflb

Anonymous said...

Unless, of course, you're not from Canada/Poland who gives a shit what you think, because most of like to believe we do have a high standard of moral law that allows us not to tolerate such actions as the "Robert Dziekanski" murder

Anonymous said...

ranting anonymous

You Are Retarded!

B Wright said...

Good news: Just finished reading all the latest news. Full public inquiry launched by Provincial Government.Full public inquiry announced by Prime minister harper into the whole affair. Stockwell Day issues statement that officers in attendance may have to face charges.All in all a great day for Canada and those of us who believe in the principal of justice for all.

And oh my Ego its in good shape I'm celebrating the Canada I love.

Anonymous said...

B wright

Thankyou for a post containing such hope.

This Canadian shares your enthusiasm for all that is right!

D.Dickin said...

Quote: What is the point in spending all those tax dollars into all those investigations if all is "reasonable actions the police took to protect us?"

Unless, of course, you're not from Canada, and who gives a shit what you think, because most of like to believe we do have a high standard of moral law that allows us not to tolerate such actions as the "Robert Dziekanski" murder


We don't spend tax dollars on those independent investigations. Those are paid for by the province, or through fundraising, grants, donations, and other ways of raising money. They exist because of idiots like you who always find the police to be in the wrong, and like to question every single movement they do.

By the way, I'm definitely from Canada.

Anonymous said...

d.dickin

Idiots like me?

Thankyou; I am proud to stand with the majority of Canadians that still believe MURDER ought to stay against the law of morality...Because unlike our opposition minority Canadians We hold a much higher standard for the value for human life.

D.Dickin said...

Quote: Thankyou; I am proud to stand with the majority of Canadians that still believe MURDER ought to stay against the law of morality...Because unlike our opposition minority Canadians We hold a much higher standard for the value for human life.

I too believe that murder is against the law and against common morality. But there's a problem: this isn't murder ;) Nice try though.

Anonymous said...

d.dicken;

I apologize to you;
So sad any Canadian can watch a MURDER live and not call it what it is.

But, I sincerely apologize for the fact that I highly doubt you will find any one here to open your senses to legalized murder; Which by the way, is not legalized yet.

This is the REAL problem:

Canada's only hope for maintaining such values would be ourselves, yep US lunatics...each and every one of us. My hope is that we continue to out number the blind for a very long time to come.

Cheers!

andy Stout said...

SUGGESTION:
Why can't all of you "anonymous" people make up an anonymous name? Then everyone can tell which anonymous person is which. Reading these post is so confusing when everyone is called "Anonymous"!

D.J said...

ok

D.J said...

d.dicken;

I apologize to you;
So sad any Canadian can watch a MURDER live and not call it what it is.

But, I sincerely apologize for the fact that I highly doubt you will find any one here to open your senses to legalized murder; Which by the way, is not legalized yet.

This is the REAL problem:

Canada's only hope for maintaining such values would be ourselves, yep US lunatics...each and every one of us. My hope is that we continue to out number the blind for a very long time to come.

Cheers!

D.Dickin said...

Quote: SUGGESTION:
Why can't all of you "anonymous" people make up an anonymous name? Then everyone can tell which anonymous person is which. Reading these post is so confusing when everyone is called "Anonymous"!


Unfortunately, they seem to be too cowardly to provide their name to back up their statements.

Ironically, people died defending our country so they could have that right, and they're not complaining.

D.Dickin said...

Quote: So sad any Canadian can watch a MURDER live and not call it what it is.

But, I sincerely apologize for the fact that I highly doubt you will find any one here to open your senses to legalized murder; Which by the way, is not legalized yet.


Wow you're thick headed.

Definition of murder from www.google.ca: unlawful, premeditated killing of a human being by a human being.

That was not a murder. Simple as that.

D.J said...

d.dickin;

Wow you're thick headed?

Here is a definition of "thick headed"

D.Dickin said...

"Your one-sided generic letter will not petition either Mr. Day or an MP into action, especially when these actions were justified."


All the noise in parliament is not in response to a minority few that cannot see the truth for what it is;

It is in response to those of us who refuse to tolerate murder by the hands of our authorities

B Wright said...

Here is a link to a story that just broke on CBC a 1:00.Keep in mind this is an unarmed woman with her hands handcuffed behind her back.Required reading for RCMP apologists
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2007/11/21/taser-review.html

D.J said...

d.dickin

Quite interesting you should resort to www.google.ca for a definition of "MURDER"

Even so - I will entertain it

www.criminalfindlaw.com

Second-degree murder is ordinarily defined as 1) an intentional killing that is not premeditated or planned, nor committed in a reasonable "heat of passion" or 2) a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life.

Sound familiar?

D.J said...

b.wright;
I have read that link;
Yes..indeed another unnecassary taser hit.

I have copied your post and integrated it into another debate on the same topic.

Hope you don't mind

B Wright said...

D J
Not at all I don't mind. It is about spreading the relative info and making everyone aware of what really goes on. Good on you for sharing the info.

B Wright said...

Newfoundland police announce The use of Tasers is suspended

B Wright said...

D J if your still there the officer in qestion was reprimanded and had his taser priveledge taken away for one year It's on Yahoo.ca news now

D.J said...

b.wright;

excellent
thankyou.

B Wright said...

To Raving Anonymous:

How prophetic it would be you who posted this here.

"if you would like your dignity and respect back, I can give it back to you. Only under one condition though. You can have it back when you earn it back."

For as we speak ,every two hours a new and damning revelation emerges of the RCMP abuse and misuse of tasers And now they stand in the court of public opinion and the government of the day has seen fit to strip them of their smug,arrogant superiority. One shiny button at a time from their red tunics

D.J said...

d.dicken

channeL3000.com
Reported:
"Officer Reprimanded After Accidentally Hurting Self During Taser Checkout"

Not much of a pay back...but it's a start.

Are you yet convinced these toys might be a little dangerous for people with no common sense?

D.J said...

b wright

I believe raving anonymous is the same person as the ranting anonymous.
If so I think they may have left the building at the suggestion that if they were not Canadian/Polish...well u know the rest of the story

B Wright said...

D Dicken

LOL

Cheers to you I respect the difference of opinion.I'm actually thinking of resuming my retirement my age has limited capacity for too much stimulation

D.J said...

Another debate I have been entertaining on this same subject has content that I probably shouldn't be sharing here as it is fairly twisted-BUT, I can't help myself and I seriously apologize to anyone I am probably going to offend.

WAIT! If You believe you will offended please speak now, I will wait a while before posting

D.J said...

By the Way; it is Twisted Humor

D.J said...

I am withdrawing my last two comments on the grounds that I have already been called and Idiot, thick headed(actually the one I found funny), and perhaps 1 or 2 other names I may have over looked.

No offense to anyone on any of these comments.

D.J said...

b wright;

Are you familiar with the "Ian Bush" case?

D.J said...

www.mostlywater.org

Officer shot Ian Bush in the back of his head

www.mostlywater.org
Investigators have determined that the bullet struck the centre of Ian's head, travelling on a trajectory that would have seen it exit just below his forehead, although for some reason it did not. The shot is likely to have generated a significant amount of "blow back," and would appear to rule out a scenario in which a victim has physical control of his assailant.

When journalist Gary Mason of The Globe and Mail asked the RCMP media department about numerous contradictory facts relating to the Bush death that the RCMP were evading or stonewalling, Constable John Ward stated, "The public doesn't have a right to know anything."

So what we have is more Dead men and a murdering national police force that gets away with brutality and homicide and cover-up every day.

D.J said...

Young, 22 year old Ian Bush

D.Dickin said...

Quote: Here is a link to a story that just broke on CBC a 1:00.Keep in mind this is an unarmed woman with her hands handcuffed behind her back.Required reading for RCMP apologists

The woman was drunk and refused to get in her cell, so they used the taser to get control of her.

What's the problem?...

D.J said...

d.dickin

in case you didn't have time to finsish reading that column, I have brought it to you;

Kennedy's commission at the time ruled that the first use of the Taser was justified in the case, but the subsequent applications were improper. The commission recommended that officers receive more training on use of Tasers and that the force apologize to the woman.

Your Welcome

D.J said...

d.dickin;

http://www.suntimes.com/news/mitchell/636574,CST-NWS-mitch06.article

82 YEAR OLD WOMAN TASERED

D.J said...

d.dickin

Could it be, the Gangs are emerging without fear...possibly because they have not a lot too fear. As our police seem to be entertaining themselves with 4 to 1 murders? All the while, testing the true strength of their new toys on innocent people across our great land.

Two men were shot late last night in Vancouver in a gangland style shooting." The Vancouver Sun reports:

"Both men -- in their 20s -- died at the scene of the gangland-style shooting and their bodies remained inside a four-door silver Mercedes for hours while police continued their investigation.

The men were not the only recent victims of gang violence.


On Saturday, a man was gunned down outside of his house in Vancouver's upscale Shaugnessy neighbourhood. The man was later identified as Hong Chao [Raymond] Huang, who authorities say has links with Asian organized crime.

Police have not linked both crimes but the Lower Mainland has seen a particularly bloody year for gang violence. Last month in Surrey, B.C. six people were found dead in an apartment. Four of the men were alleged to have ties to gangs and drug dealing. Two were innocent by-standers.


In August, two men were killed in a Chinese restaurant. The case had police worried about the possibility of reprisals.

D.J said...

Another taser death this week:

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071122/dartmouth_taser_071122/20071122?hub=TopStories

D.Dickin said...

Quote: d.dickin;

http://www.suntimes.com/news/mitchell/636574,CST-NWS-mitch06.article

82 YEAR OLD WOMAN TASERED


I guess she shouldn't have refused to open the door then...

D.J said...

d.dickin;

Yea that's it!

That all you have?

The gush of truth is drowning you;

Just ask; I'll keep trying to throw life lines out for you!

B Wright said...

There is the two of you left on this site.

D.J said...

b wright

would you be 3?

D.J said...

b wright and d.dicken

you might be interested in viewing this site

http://criticalculture.blogspot.com/2007/11/prince-i-wish-you-had-seen-execution.html

I dont't think either of you will regret it

Yes, d.dickin it does have sharp shots of truth but I know you can sponge it up.

I believe you are a truth seeker, I am intigued debating with you.

D.J said...

b wright
&
d.dickin

chillowack man pepper sprayed, beaten with baton, and tasered - remains in critical condition in hospital.

The incident remains under investigation by the Chilliwack RCMP serious crime section.

How much brutality is B.C expected to tolerate?

Would never hear of them using; pepper spray, baton, or taser on gang members, that might be cosidered a contribution to society.

They just keep getting better!

D.J said...

The 82 year old woman is still my favorite.

Oh..to be in the court room listening to that.

D.Dickin said...

Quote: chillowack man pepper sprayed, beaten with baton, and tasered - remains in critical condition in hospital.

The incident remains under investigation by the Chilliwack RCMP serious crime section.


I guess he just didn't want to stop fighting. There is absolutely nothing that says this case was overdone. They don't just beat on people for fun.

B Wright said...

D.J
D Dickin
I agree They don't beat on people for fun. But to me thats the point. With the gun with the baton they know they can inflict great physical harm. With the Taser they have been brainwashed into believing it is non lethal when all evidence points to the fact that being tasered and dying is easily related in almost 300 hundred instances. What compounds this is the majority of cases are people unarmed and doing little other than failing to comply. Tasering a woman in handcuffs is a good example. The traffic cop tasering the fellow for not signing his ticket. It's just too easy and has too like no consequences. I wonder what the death toll is for state executions in the US for a similar time frame as the 280 taser related deaths.I use the word related.

D.J said...

d.dickin

Trying to give the RCMP benefit of the doubt, with these never ending disturbing arrests.

I wouldn't be opposed to most if we were hearing Gang members were being apprehended in such a manner, I have yet to hear of one.

Yes, if they were truly cleaning things up, instead they keep making
messes.

B Wright said...

Well thats two taser related deaths in one week. One involving Vancouver and the RCMP again. I don't suggest the taser killed them,I suggest it is a very crucial and obvious factor in the death in custody of innocent until proven guilty citizens.

How many times in recent memory have so many died being arrested. My belief is that before taser we didn't have this abundance of fatalities

D.J said...

Indeed b.wright Indeed!

BC rcmp look like programmed robots.

I get the impression it starts at the top.

Chilliwack victim died last night shortly after midnight!!

On Monday afternoon, Gary Bass, commanding officer of the RCMP in B.C., said he’s worried that his officers could become “Taser shy” following public criticism over the use of a Taser on Dziekanski, a Polish immigrant who died at Vancouver International Airport on Oct. 14.

THEY'RE STILL DOING YOU PROUD GARY BASS...REST WELL!

B Wright said...

D.J.
I remember reading that comment From Bass and thinking he hasn't grasped the situation he' still in damage control.

however my thoughts now are of the increasing frequency of events. is this just a set of coincidences or is this the manifestation of a frustrated group of police officers believing that whatever they do this hardline Conservative government will back them and protect them.

I think of the images of another infamous video of Police brutality.The Rodney king incident. Those images of him being repeatedly beaten with batons as they took turns. A six foot plus 300 pound man who was combative. .......But he didn't die.

So I ask myself in this latest incident in Vancouver where the man was ,pepper sprayed beaten with batons and tasered. Were all these levels of force required,....or enjoyed.

D.J said...

b wright;

I agree;

Makes me wonder if it's a ploy of defense in Robert Dziekanski case;

Would you rather a Taser death?
OR
A Blood Bath ending in Death!

Insane thought - parrallel to RCMP actions!

D.J said...

b wright

Chilliwack man died Friday just after midnight.

The cause of death has yet to be determined.

I suppose there are 3 scenario's to consider;
- Taser
- Baton beatings to the head
- Combination of both (the one confusing experts with possiblity of the other two)

B Wright said...

Well now here we have the kicker. A man and woman arrested for first degree murder for Harrison home invasion. here is a quote from the story.

"The man and woman, both in their twenties, were arrested without incident on Friday night after the RCMP obtained a description of the suspects.

At the time of the arrests, RCMP said both suspects were wearing bulletproof vests."

Fascinating they weren't acting erratically just in a homicidal sort of way. I assume this was a guns drawn no chances arrest and the good judgment of the perps to surrender saves their lives. So "IF" that is the case why do we need taser. Why don't we go back to old style policing.It's my opinion more people actually survived the arrest experience.It's also my opinion coming from a small resource town that drunken loggers and fisherman etc. posed a greater risk to personal safety Than Mr. Dziekanski. Just a thought.

D.Dickin said...

Quote: I wouldn't be opposed to most if we were hearing Gang members were being apprehended in such a manner, I have yet to hear of one.

That's not fair either. You're saying it'd be okay if gangsters were shot and killed with tasers, but as soon as a man high on drugs struggles with police and dies it's not right. What kind of dream world are you living in?

D.Dickin said...

Quote: How many times in recent memory have so many died being arrested. My belief is that before taser we didn't have this abundance of fatalities

The media is having a feeding frenzy because they know it'll get the shallow reactions out of idiots like you. There were deaths before tasers, and there will still be deaths after the taser.

D.Dickin said...

Quote: I suppose there are 3 scenario's to consider;
- Taser
- Baton beatings to the head
- Combination of both (the one confusing experts with possiblity of the other two)


You're forgetting that there could have also been a pre-existing condition in the man that caused the death. For example, if the man had a heart condition and the taser affected this, then the man died from the heart condition, not the taser.

D.J said...

d.dickin

Weak defenses - I'm sure they are going to try every one of them.

If the taser caused a weak heart to attack.

Then the attack of the taser still caused the death.

I expect the death is a result of being beaten in the head with their tough boy clubs though.

There is a guy from military suing RCMP for lacerations from being tazered 8 times. He has some nasty looking burn scars.

They're acting like they cannot be challenged?
Hmmm - BE CAREFUL

D.J said...

d.dickin:
Easy on the name calling - it sheds bad taste

D.Dickin said...

Quote: If the taser caused a weak heart to attack.

Then the attack of the taser still caused the death.


No it didn't... the heart condition did.

D.J said...

d.dickin

There is no heart condition

D.J said...

d.dickin

56 year old woman in wheel chair
tasered 10 times.

The report said. On her death certificate, the medical examiner ruled Delafield’s death a homicide.

Hmmm...I expect being in agreement with murder, defending it and encouraging it, MUST make one just as guilty as the one doing it.

Sad, Sad state to be in d.dickin

B Wright said...

D Dicken

I agree the press is having a field day getting reaction from the general public and I'm pleased you saw fit to group me with them. The reaction you refer to of course is Outrage at the RCMP For lying and fabricating a story of the events that day. Its my opinion that; generally people will lie in an attempt to cover up something.And of course the other reaction is empathy for the victim and his family.Contrary to your opinion that it is shallow it is one of the higher emotions. One of the things that set us apart from the other creatures. No I think a shallow reaction would be that of the psychopath who would trivialize the loss of life any life for he really places no value non it. Snuffing out a life is inconsequential to the psychopath,sort of like snuffing out a match>Hey whats the big deal right?
I would call an idiot anyone who had with unnecessary force subdued someone,then having established there was no pulse failed to attempt CPR which they are trained in, Choosing instead to stand like hunters over their prey.That's an idiot a negligent one. And there in lies one of the tragedies here.At that precise moment those four idiots had a chance to be heroes.

D.Dickin said...

Quote: d.dickin

There is no heart condition


How do you know this?

D.Dickin said...

Quote: 56 year old woman in wheel chair
tasered 10 times.

The report said. On her death certificate, the medical examiner ruled Delafield’s death a homicide.

Hmmm...I expect being in agreement with murder, defending it and encouraging it, MUST make one just as guilty as the one doing it.


Where did this come from? Cite?

B Wright said...

D.J.
I see like me you have researched Taser.I have come to some conclusions I would like to share.

Firstly Taser is far from the useful tool it is being touted as.It is, in my opinion, law enforcements and societies worst nightmare to come. As we speak this weapon is being marketed and sold worldwide as a safe non lethal weapon as proven by international law enforcement agencies.You purchase direct from Taser international for 60 euro in Germany.In the States you can buy one off the shelf no waiting period no record check.So a criminal buys one. You just don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out what he's going to do with it.Oh lets add terrorists,rapists, child molesters,etc. etc.

In the articles I have included I found of special interest that The Department Of Homeland Defense is investing money in alternate technology the fear being the voltage from taser could detonate a bomb strapped terrorist in a crowded airport, stadium etc. I was also interested to see that Police in California found taser unsatisfactory,so much so they reach for the pepper spray because they have more confidence in it's results and effect.
I support a ban on tasers because I believe our law enforcement need less choices not more.Their job requires thinking on their feet they don't have time to do mental gymnastics. I believe thats what we see in the default to taser. The dangerous part of that for me is that the officer has to possibly face taser one day.It strikes me almost comical to think of two individuals zapping each other for control,right out of Monte Python.No confusion please anything that looks like a gun deadly force. That's just how it has to be I think. Then of course there will be issues over the death of a man armed with a Taser the police themselves certified safe.

Finally I don't believe YVR was Murder Negligence Yes.And I hope those in attendance are charged under some form of negligence causing death.I have faith in the system that there will be taser protocol changes.I would prefer an outright ban.I'd like to see them on histories scrap heap with the rack and thumb screw.
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1678641,00.html?xid=feed-cnn-topics
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1001745,00.html

D.J said...

b wright

I also learned of the liberal sales of tasers, you're right, very scary.
Even for kids in the form of innocent looking toys. The idea is to give a kid a chance to run from would be abductors. Great idea, but so much for trying to counter act school yard bullying.
An absolute on Taser Ban, how many lives will take, B Wright, before they GET IT?

I keep swaying on the Murder/Negligence issue. The actions of the officer that knelt down holding pressure on his neck and head is where I have trouble.
He was in an obvious state of fighting for his life before that happened and 4 officers couldn't put one full brain cell together to figure that out. What was the point in holding him like that for so long?
They are all trained in First aid/CPR, they knew or ought to have known.
Definite Negligence - too arrogant to apply CPR. I know it probably won't go any further than Negligence, I just hope we get to here an intelligent explanation, without a bunch of cover-up crap.

Never heard of anyone being charged for plain Stupidity

B Wright said...

D Dicken
I came upon this and thought you might read it. It's a Macleans article about what's killing the RCMP. It details internal racism and general dis function.I only put it out here because it is indicative of a lot of the comments posted here by others.Anyway it documents a proud institution in ruins.


http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/21112007
/21/s-really-killing-mounties.html

B Wright said...

D Dicken sorry about that this link should work better
http://www.macleans.ca/canada/national
/article.jsp?content=20071114_10512_10512

B Wright said...

NO IT DOESN'T
SO GOOGLE "What's really killing the Mounties"

Anonymous said...

Brian Dell you sound retarded. To the fireman, get a new job if you think it was okay for RCMP to do what they did, lie and cover up - did you forget that part, clearly you are incompotent yourself.

I hope those 4 RCMP are charged with manslaughter. There ain't one Holy book that would justify what you were saying, fireman.

It's scary that RCMP would do something like that, and not have a more decent approach.

THank you to whoever published that letter to help Robert get justice. Letter sent.